The intention of having scoreboards on qualified maps was to allow players to play the maps and then report back issues they found with it, but after several months of testing, the only result of having scoreboards on these maps is huge drama and complaints from players who lose their scores when a map is disqualified. Internally we are considering removing scoreboards to avoid the backlash when a map is disqualified to improve the quality of life for everyone.

What do you guys think? Reply with if you have more to say than just a poll choice.

TO BE CLEAR: Qualified is the state a map is in for 7 days before being ranked, during which it can be disqualified should any issues be found.

Nice, I see. I'd like to see them stay until the map is ranked.
Perhaps a message stating "your score won't count until this map is officially ranked" or something.

There should be a clearer indication in-game if the map is qualified or ranked imo.

It's still nice to see who the top players for that beatmap are.. regardless of it is ranked or not. I say keep it and just don't award the player until it's approved.

3rd option seems very much ideal and a nice compromise.

at least I hope it has different icon with ranked maps so people could see the difference
EDIT: I think 3rd choice is the best choice I could choose considering much drama on dq maps

yes having a scoreboard is good and bad, bad, because players got pissed off when they lose their pp, but at the same time by not having a scoreboard probably no one will try those maps and the qualified section will not work as intended to be. Probably keeping the scoreboard, but not giving pp is the better idea.

Players who try the map generally don't report issues with it. It's the actual QAT that do the checking.

Since its only qualified, it could always be DQ'd if something seems amiss, so i guess it would be wise to not reward the players with pp in a qualified map since its still in the phase of "Check and Recheck". But i think keeping the scoreboard would keep the competition up to motivate the players to play more. Keeping the scoreboard could also be a way to give the mappers an idea of how the map really plays, since you can see the replays (right?) of top 50 plays, which is basically filled with skilled and experienced players.

So thats how i see it, i could be wrong though :v

If the maps got DQ, don't wipe that scores because some player don't like to retry/play same map.

Edit : I Think For Qualify Maps set for another icon, don't use the love icon

Lina Sintyadewi wrote: 2i6d6j

If the maps got DQ, don't wipe that scores because some player don't like to retry/play same map.

I think you're missing the point. The maps CHANGE after getting disqualified, which makes any scores set incorrect.

I agree it either should be removed completely or there should be the warning, like: "7 days remaining till permanent qualification" or something, which would count like that. That would maybe prevent disqualified maps from terrible ratings - I there were maps with almost 10 score, but after disqualification, they got many of insensible 1 stars. Not like that score determines anything, but players just don't often realize that it's not mapper's fault, when warning is given, but they are only warned if they enter qualified section, if someone sends them the song directly, they might not know their scores may be removed.

Just throwing my 2 cents here.

//Also I firstly had a little heart attack when I read: "Should we remove STORYBOARDS from qualified maps?" xDD

Graf wrote: 5r6y26

There should be a clearer indication in-game if the map is qualified or ranked imo.

Absolutely this. When somebody links you a map and you it via osu!direct, there's seemingly no way of being able to tell whether it is qualified or not; perhaps a new icon for qualified maps would be sufficient. Either way, I voted for qualified maps not giving pp - as Xilver said, I'd agree that it is the best compromise. People seem unable to handle disqualifications for maps in which they or others have gained pp from (myself being guilty of that on a few occasions), despite the fact that that is far from the reason for the qualified section.

I can see an influx in people complaining about not receiving PP with the third option, however I feel it's probably the most appropriate.

I can recall there being a F-req on giving qualified maps a enw symbol, like a moon, a heart with a nuke, or a blue heart
I think that should be good enough though
However, to avoid drama, as that will happen because many people are ignorant, 3rd option is byfar the best there is

No pp untill ranked will be the best option. pp is the source of all dramas after all. Besides most people tend to wait until they get ranked so they dont lose pp.

3rd option is clearly the best
Also an unavoidable warning that says "this map can be disqualified at any time" should be included

i agree with this. when dq some map, it gives feels 'lost' to players also mappers. so i think, we should remove scoreboard from qualified map.
then we will get better feelings more than now when map's dq.

qwr wrote: 43mg

3rd option is clearly the best
Also an unavoidable warning that says "this map can be disqualified at any time" should be included

pretty much this.
It feels really hurts when losing a pp

I feel like dumb fucks will complain double about "not getting pp from X map" if the pp is removed. Remove the score board and I'll be far less inclined to test a map. I like it how it is, a few comments in map threads is worth the additional play testing.

jesus1412 wrote: 4s456t

I feel like dumb fucks will complain double about "not getting pp from X map" if the pp is removed.

I completely agree.

Illiterate and ignorant people will always complain
No matter what
A message saying You'll get no pp from this map should be fine
As long as it covers the whole screen
For 5 seconds
In multiple colors

peppy wrote: 115z70

jesus1412 wrote: 4s456t

I feel like dumb fucks will complain double about "not getting pp from X map" if the pp is removed.

I completely agree.

Am I one of the rare breeds of players left that really doesn't give two shits about this? Just saying.

EDIT: "This map is in qualified status, qualified maps will only give Performance Points after the map is fully ranked!" <-- This message seems fairly satisfactory

What about cases where the map doesn't change? Say it was a metadata issue, which has no effect on actual gameplay?

Regardless... if the scoreboard were removed there would no longer be any incentive to play the maps before they were ranked. People usually play maps in qualified to secure top/#1 ranks on the lower diffs (mapsets with no spinners are especially prone to this) or to get pp. I think the third option is the most ideal because people will get to keep their scores/pp if the map es qualified.

At the same time, however, if you were to implement this, pp gain needs to be hidden from players somehow, otherwise even if a map does not immediately reward a player pp, they will still assume they have obtain those pp, and this would still create drama should a map get disqualified because players will be "expecting a top play". Basically at the end of the day, if a map is dq'ed, you are still going to get people saying "rip my 300 pp score etc etc" even if they never actually got it added onto their Top Plays (yet). I doubt this can be fully avoided, because players can always estimate about how much pp they would have received...

Maybe something like remove pp but keep scoreboard or remove scoreboard but keep pp

For now, I think just adding a at the top of the scoreboard ingame to warn players is fine, because the main problem for them complaining about is that we can't recognize ranked/qualified maps in-game because they both are marked with a heart

monstrata wrote: 5t5v6z

At the same time, however, if you were to implement this, pp gain needs to be hidden from players somehow, otherwise even if a map does not immediately reward a player pp, they will still assume they have obtain those pp, and this would still create drama should a map get disqualified because players will be "expecting a top play". Basically at the end of the day, if a map is dq'ed, you are still going to get people saying "rip my 300 pp score etc etc" even if they never actually got it added onto their Top Plays (yet). I doubt this can be fully avoided, because players can always estimate about how much pp they would have received...

I was thinking the same thing
To put it in different , qualified scores should not be "gambles", or "this score has a chance of giving me pp"

If you want to cut down drama, remove pp from qualified maps, so it's only about the leaderboard or score

peppy wrote: 115z70

Players who try the map generally don't report issues with it. It's the actual QAT that do the checking.

One reason this may happen is because some may see a person pointing out issues in a qualified map as a malicious act, either against the mapper or BNs involved.

It's stupid, but sometimes I see that modding maps post-qualification is discouraged (whether ively or aggressively) and those who do are told that doing so should be left solely to the QAT.

I agree with this. In fact I was considering making a thread myself. There is no reason to have qualified maps give pp; if they do, yes more people will play it, but they'll only be playing it for the pp. If they don't give pp, the people who play the map will be much more likely to be doing so to actually test the map, which is the purpose of the system. If you let them have a scoreboard, you will run into a similar problem of people complaining when people didn't get pp from FCing the map as indicated by the scoreboard.
I also think that when map is ranked it should have gone through thorough testing, and only rarely should it have to be recalled due to a previously undetected issue. I shouldn't be the norm. The yoyoing of maps in and out of a ranked state, especially of popular ones that have the community's attention (like Toumei Elegy), just make the mapping team look unprofessional, whatever the case may be.

To be honest, most of the problems and bitching come from the maps getting DQ'd themselves, not the actual PP loss (though I won't deny there are problems on this end as well sometimes)

That third option is completely stupid though. "hiding" pp isn't going to solve any of the problems. monstrata pretty much sums everything up. People will always complain, even if they don't have a specific number to look at.

One thing I'm going to mention though, is that if scores/pp get disabled, then map ratings should be as well.

In my opinion - keep them but don't reward performance points for score.

Personaly scoreboard is fun and allows to compete with others, check scores and approximately amount of points what you need IF map get's ranked (i know it's not ppv1 anymore but there are still people who like to fight over #1 just for fun).
Qualified maps should not be rewarded at all becouse in case of DQ it creates only sad/toxic spam in map topic.

peppy wrote: 115z70

jesus1412 wrote: 4s456t

I feel like dumb fucks will complain double about "not getting pp from X map" if the pp is removed.

I completely agree.

But this is better than more drama from loss after a DQ, yes?

Lanturn wrote: 6t6w4t

SPOILER

To be honest, most of the problems and bitching come from the maps getting DQ'd themselves, not the actual PP loss (though I won't deny there are problems on this end as well sometimes)

That third option is completely stupid though. "hiding" pp isn't going to solve any of the problems. monstrata pretty much sums everything up. People will always complain, even if they don't have a specific number to look at.

One thing I'm going to mention though, is that if scores/pp get disabled, then map ratings should be as well.

The third option is actually ambiguous - it doesn't specify [in qualification] if pp rewarding will be delayed or not considered at all

It actually does to me. "Don't reward until ranked"

tl;dr,
Why do we need to keep the scoreboard that players can't even earn any pp or w/e from it anyway? I feel that some players would start establishing new dramas than the old ones, and other shtstorms.

Uhh, I know it's only for some testplays or sth else. But IMFO, It's best we remove the scoreboards.

I think a combination of option 3 and having a new icon to indicate a map is only in the qualified state ingame would be the ideal solution, personally. I'm still surprised there's no ingame distinction between Qualified and Ranked, and that is probably the source of a good deal of drama.

qwr wrote: 43mg

The third option is actually ambiguous - it doesn't specify [in qualification] if pp rewarding will be delayed or not considered at all

The big problem is if you actually have to play the map again and you can't beat your score (a Tie for example doesn't overwrite it) You're basically screwed forever without earning PP. I don't see how it's possible for the third option to be treated in that manner. It definitely means you'll earn your PP once it moves to ranked. If this was the case, I'd rather have all scores wiped upon ranking.

peppy wrote: 115z70

Lina Sintyadewi wrote: 2i6d6j

If the maps got DQ, don't wipe that scores because some player don't like to retry/play same map.

I think you're missing the point. The maps CHANGE after getting disqualified, which makes any scores set incorrect.

Like monstrata mentioned, not all beatmaps change after disqualifications or every map that is included in the mapset does.
As much as the third option is the most ideal option for this poll, I would say there should be a 4th option of making every scoreboard of every map in a mapset to not get deleted as long as the actual map didn't change during the time the mapset got disqualified.
Some diqualifications are not all about the actual map but rather the meta data or just one map out of a full mapset, then, when a mapset gets disqualified due to one or few of the difficulties their scoreboard should not be deleted on maps that didn't change in the mapset during the time the mapset is disqualified.
I should also add that there should be an option for the qats to have two types of disqualifications, the one that disqualifies a map for a flaw on the actual map and therefore would make the scores deleted on that map. And a disqualification for metadatab change that would save the scoreboard of the entire mapset.

MrPotato wrote: 4z405v

Like monstrata mentioned, not all beatmaps change after disqualifications or every map that is included in the mapset does.
As much as the third option is the most ideal option for this poll, I would say there should be a 4th option of making every scoreboard of every map in a mapset to not get deleted as long as the actual map didn't change during the time the mapset got disqualified.
Some diqualifications are not all about the actual map but rather the meta data or just one map out of a full mapset, then, when a mapset gets disqualified due to one or few of the difficulties their scoreboard should not be deleted on maps that didn't change in the mapset during the time the mapset is disqualified.

As much of a popular opinion this is. With the current system, it will never happen. One small change to the map could completely mess up scores, replays or other things. How do you know the mapper didn't move one object slightly before it got requalified? It isn't worth it. It's better to wipe the scores to avoid any possible problems down the line when relating to scores/replays.

I would rather have partial disqualifications, where only the diffs that caused the DQ would get score wiped as they're expected to be changed, and metadata/bg "disqualifications" would never happen, if it's something that requires the mapper's intervention just put it in a locked qualified state without wiping any score.
I get that this isn't possible with the current beatmap submission system, but I feel like this poll is solving a non-problem, instead of focusing on (some of the) WHY people hate disqualifications so much:
- A disqualification and subsequent score wipe can happen on a diff you haven't even played, on a gamemode you don't even know exists.
- Maps that give pp nomod/HR have a high star difficulty and are usually pretty long = more diffs, longer diffs = more possible points of failure = more disqualifications = Asymmetry.
- Metadata and BG disqualifications are universally considered bullshit. See: MANIERA, rip jhlee's 1234pp score.

Qualified maps should have scoreboards and give pp.

Lanturn wrote: 6t6w4t

MrPotato wrote: 4z405v

Like monstrata mentioned, not all beatmaps change after disqualifications or every map that is included in the mapset does.
As much as the third option is the most ideal option for this poll, I would say there should be a 4th option of making every scoreboard of every map in a mapset to not get deleted as long as the actual map didn't change during the time the mapset got disqualified.
Some diqualifications are not all about the actual map but rather the meta data or just one map out of a full mapset, then, when a mapset gets disqualified due to one or few of the difficulties their scoreboard should not be deleted on maps that didn't change in the mapset during the time the mapset is disqualified.

As much of a popular opinion this is. With the current system, it will never happen. One small change to the map could completely mess up scores, replays or other things. How do you know the mapper didn't move one object slightly before it got requalified? It isn't worth it. It's better to wipe the scores to avoid any possible problems down the line when relating to scores/replays.

if maps are changed during the disqualification period the specific maps that changed would be needed to be updated, with the current system if a map is not changed in a mapset at all you would not need to update it in order to play its ranked version.
Also every minor change in .osu files is noticed.

Tbh, I don't see why metadata issues require a disqualification to fix. Can the staff not fix such issues internally? Because it literally takes the mapper like all of 30 seconds to make metadata changes and re the map... Can't little things like this be done without the need to DQ?

monstrata wrote: 5t5v6z

Tbh, I don't see why metadata issues require a disqualification to fix. Can the staff not fix such issues internally? Because it literally takes the mapper like all of 30 seconds to make metadata changes and re the map... Can't little things like this be done without the need to DQ?

when osz2 comes.

I would want the scoreboards to be at least kept onto the qualified maps. But don't calculate pp until the map finally gets ranked.

^^
Hope it appears!

I think that if scores don't get ed at all like maps that aren't ranked would eliminate all this drama since people who play those maps would only provide constructive criticism instead of creating a scene after losing performance points due to disqualification.

How will not rewarding pp right away stop any drama at all? If the map is dequalified, the scores set are still lost.

Graf wrote: 5r6y26

There should be a clearer indication in-game if the map is qualified or ranked imo.

This

DRRR wrote: 2y1862

How will not rewarding pp right away stop any drama at all? If the map is dequalified, the scores set are still lost.

I don't think the majority of people see a decent score as something valuable on it's own; rather, the PP it awards. By delaying PP rewards, nobody gets any PP, so nobody has PP to lose if the map gets disqualified.

I think people just get annoyed because their arbitrary number measuring performance has gone down

3rd looks the best.

DRRR wrote: 2y1862

How will not rewarding pp right away stop any drama at all? If the map is dequalified, the scores set are still lost.

When people aren't capable enough to take some seconds to understand what Qualified means then there is no reason to whine about the "loss" of a single score.

Some have already said it, but I think the issue is more the visability of the ranked status than anything else.

For most maps you don't know when they will be fully ranked or if they already are unless you check on the website and to do that for 10+ maps everyday can be a hassle. I think the only thing that needs to be changed is the icon for qualified maps. Instead of a heart make it a star, a triangle or something like that.

EDIT: Or even better, make the symbol the number of days that map has already been in qualified status.

The solely reason why people don't like doing awesome scores on qualified maps is because they could lose a huge amount of pp in the process in case of DQ, so... there goes my vote on the 3rd option.

Wafu wrote: t2q5t

I agree it either should be removed completely or there should be the warning, like: "7 days remaining till permanent qualification" or something, which would count like that.

I think this is a good point. I there was once a warning for the old approved beatmaps saying 'this will not be counted on your ranked score' or something.

Providing in-game for players will be something most s will agree.

That's a good idea
I also like Allsiss's idea, about the symbol indicating how long it has to go
Perhaps a nuclear Heart counting down, and when time's up, it's ranked (and the nuke goes away) (idk)

Xilver wrote: 464f1a

3rd option seems very much ideal and a nice compromise.

I have to agree with you on that and like the other guy said there should also be a clearer indication if it's qualified or ranked.

Graf wrote: 5r6y26

There should be a clearer indication in-game if the map is qualified or ranked imo.

Yup.

3rd option and maybe have a message that pops up at the start of playing a qualified map telling you that its qualified and that you wont receive pp until the map is ranked, kinda like the message about deleting backgrounds make osu angggryyyyyyyyyy! use background dim instead thing, that way it should be blatantly clear that you wont get pp and that its qualified, whist still allowing for people to see neat scores that top players make

Sonnyc wrote: 586w5g

Wafu wrote: t2q5t

I agree it either should be removed completely or there should be the warning, like: "7 days remaining till permanent qualification" or something, which would count like that.

I think this is a good point. I there was once a warning for the old approved beatmaps saying 'this will not be counted on your ranked score' or something.

Providing in-game for players will be something most s will agree.

+1
Removing pp from qualified maps and adding this is, in my opinion, the best way to go about doing this.

Almost of noob player is love Qualified map because of easier get first place than ranked map

Map rank is show about player's skill so good player must be the high rank, so i think it is just self-conplacency to take 1st in qualified map

I think it doesn't need

"Keep them but don't reward performance points until ranked"

Seems like the best option for everyone. Let's us keep an eye on the scores for fun and challange, but won't be rewarded until it's confirmed it's going to be ranked, which is cool.

I like to tackle qualified maps for the challenge/ replays watched as opposed to the pp rewarded, so I think I'll agree with the third option. It would be a shame to see leaderboards disappear entirely

Last options sound nice for me, I don't care how much pp I get and it's can calculate later after 7 days imo.

I personally find that watching the replays of qualified maps is useful for the mapper in the case the map does get disqualified.

Pretty sure Lanturn mentioned this earlier, but I'd rather go with a completely different tactic. Players can continue to compete and earn pp while in qualified, but their scores and pp gains are wiped upon ranked. This will allow people to test their playing abilities (and the beatmap, provide if needed too), see how the map will affect their overall pp, and avoid heartbreak when a map is disqualified since they were going to lose the pp anyway. It fits the whole "cutting edge" motif qualified beatmaps have. In multiple alpha/beta tests, most of the time you don't carry your work into the finished product (mmos with their character data, for example).

Of course, players that don't already mind losing their scores will play in qualified maps (those that should be) so they won't complain/cause a drama. Those that do mind, however, will stay away and wait the process out (or give the beatmap a try). We'll definitely need some sort of qualified indicator ingame if this were to happen though.

If we can't do the above, then it is the third option for me

I'm not sure about that
Okay, Qualified comes with a risk, but there should also be a reward (score stays if map is good enough)

Edit: Wow, already 1200+ votes O.o

Ranked maps have a heart.

Approved maps have a flame.

Qualified maps have a racing flag.

baraatje123 wrote: 3ad45

I'm not sure about that
Okay, Qualified comes with a risk, but there should also be a reward (score stays if map is good enough)

Edit: Wow, already 1200+ votes O.o

Why? Where in the qualified listing states that playing these beatmaps should give you a reward? It says it clearly in black and white, the qualified section is for people who don't mind their scores getting lost (although in this instance it would be all scores), those who want to play cutting edge beatmaps before they are released to the masses, and those that want to help keep beatmap quality top-notch (which not a lot of people seem to be doing for some reason...). With what I wrote, we change the angle of the qualified section entirely - those that want to help with beatmap quality can and those that don't mind losing scores can still play on a scoreboard + see how the pp gain affects their overall pp.

Well
I meant it in the way: Why should players be "punished" (losing score) when the map es the 7-days and thus is of high-quality
I know, it's a risk, but players shouldn't be "punished" IMO
Here I mean Not "Punished" as rewarded (probably wrong word choice tho ;w;)

baraatje123 wrote: 3ad45

Well
I meant it in the way: Why should players be "punished" (losing score) when the map es the 7-days and thus is of high-quality
I know, it's a risk, but players shouldn't be "punished" IMO
Here I mean Not "Punished" as rewarded (probably wrong word choice tho ;w;)

They aren't being punished for something they should be willing to lose in the first place. Playing for pp should not be on the forefront of a qualified player's mind. If we want people to evaluate qualified beatmaps closer and have a qualified section as it is supposed to be, we need to rethink how scoring/pp gains work in the section entirely. I think what I posted solves that issue pretty well.

I don't see how keeping Qualified scoreboards but not rewarding performance points until ranked will do anything positive. If the map gets ranked, the score is kept and so the pp is "kept"as well, you just don't get it until it's ranked. If the map gets unranked you lose the score, and so you "lose" the pp.

I can see people complaining about "Losing their amazing scores", might as well remove scoreboards to avoid these kind of conflicts with the players.

To the people complaining about losing your plays, please press f2 at the score screen.

As for the scores, it's stated that:

"During this week, there is a high chance they will return to pending if an issue is found.
If they return to pending, scores will be wiped."

To appeal to these people that say that they didn't read it, that's your problem and not peppy or any of the osu!staff's problems, but I suppose peppy could somehow work in a warning when you start up any qualified map. Possibly from banchobot?

peppy wrote: 115z70

jesus1412 wrote: 4s456t

I feel like dumb fucks will complain double about "not getting pp from X map" if the pp is removed.

I completely agree.

Triple that. Didn't consider this possibility when voting.

Also, in regards to the 3rd option (sorry if this has been asked before, I can't really read through everything now), "Keep them but don't reward performance points until ranked" this means that if the map gets ranked, the scores are kept and just then the points are being given, right?

This category is recommended for people who:

1. Want to play cutting-edge maps.
2. Want to help keep map quality top-notch!
3. Don't mind having scores removed occasionally

don't give pp on qualified maps please
especially for pp farmer they are can see pp worth before this map gets ranked
give pp after map gets ranked (if map didnt dq'ed).

add only score on top50 so we can see something there

I think the maps should appear in top scores, but be grayed out, and the score not counted in player performance. That way people could tell how much a map gave, but wouldn't feel like it was taken from them.

Second: I think the md5 hash should only be of the hitobject data and difficulty data, not of the song title and artist name, etc. that way DQ's from incorrect information (Maneria for example) would not wipe scores, but changes in the map or difficulty would wipe scores, as they should.

mappers dont listen to what people who play a qualified map have to say, you'll get a nice "you shouldve modded it before it was qualified" if you do.
picking the third option would not only have no effect on the amount of drama. but, as jesus said, it would also cause a lot of confusion.

my vote goes to yes

Lust wrote: 1m4p6q

Pretty sure Lanturn mentioned this earlier, but I'd rather go with a completely different tactic. Players can continue to compete and earn pp while in qualified, but their scores and pp gains are wiped. This will allow people to test their playing abilities (and the beatmap, provide if needed too), see how the map will affect their overall pp, and avoid heartbreak when a map is disqualified since they were going to lose the pp anyway. It fits the whole "cutting edge" motif qualified beatmaps have. In multiple alpha/beta tests, most of the time you don't carry your work into the finished product (mmos with their character data, for example).

Of course, players that don't already mind losing their scores will play in qualified maps (those that should be) so they won't complain/cause a drama. Those that do mind, however, will stay away and wait the process out (or give the beatmap a try). We'll definitely need some sort of qualified indicator ingame if this were to happen though.

If we can't do the above, then it is the third option for me

i actually like this idea (and the reasoning behind it) a lot.

My opinion:

Qualified maps should not give PP

• Reason: See MANIERA drama. The leaderboards literally got fucked up due to it's disqualify and requalify.

There must be a message in red on the qualified listing saying, "YOU WILL NOT GET PP FROM THESE MAPS"

• Reason:

  jesus1412 wrote: 4s456t

  I feel like dumb fucks will complain double about "not getting pp from X map" if the pp is removed.

Qualified maps should be clearly indicated as "Latest QUALIFIED version".

• Reason: Better indication in-game

Qualified maps should allow score listing:

• Reason: More incentive to play the map, thus more . It's also fun trying to beat other scores in DT mania while the scores are low.

What I wonder is what would happen if the scoreboard is there but the map gives no pp for qualification, and then the map gets permaranked? Would those scores just give them the pp? Will they have to reset the scores?

Third option is fine. Just give a big notification on the map so people will be less likely to complain.

i would prefer to have an icon for qualified status, else i am also pleased with the third option (no pp till ranked status)

The problem is that knowing that a record is deleted to update the score and express dissatisfaction.

I really really cant understand that

Now that I think about it the 3rd option wouldn't change much, it's a step in the right direction but generally you can guess what sort of pp you will get from a play, so people will just complain about losing the pp they would have got, instead of the pp they already got. I think lust's suggestion is great, playing a qualified map gives no permanent pp, that way at least if people are gonna complain they will complain about the system rather that the QATs and the bs ranking criteria(but that's a much bigger discussion and this isn't the time and place to go into it)

tbh I feel like the qualified maps are fine the way they are. Keeping the scoreboard but giving no pp isn't really doing anything really. Your score is still there if you fc a really hard map you are still going to get a pp rain for that score and if it dqs you will lose everything regardless. Your pp is just being held but its still there lol.

I think so, for no one will be upset, because there are no selected pp C:

Neutral wrote: 746x

tbh I feel like the qualified maps are fine the way they are. Keeping the scoreboard but giving no pp isn't really doing anything really. Your score is still there if you fc a really hard map you are still going to get a pp rain for that score and if it dqs you will lose everything regardless. Your pp is just being held but its still there lol.

Always nicer to log back in and see that you've gained some ranks then logging in and see that you've lost that many ranks

LoupDuQc wrote: 3f2e67

Neutral wrote: 746x

tbh I feel like the qualified maps are fine the way they are. Keeping the scoreboard but giving no pp isn't really doing anything really. Your score is still there if you fc a really hard map you are still going to get a pp rain for that score and if it dqs you will lose everything regardless. Your pp is just being held but its still there lol.

Always nicer to log back in and see that you've gained some ranks then logging in and see that you've lost that many ranks

I guess it is a mental thing. I've never really minded losing ranks to dqs. I actually enjoy dqs tbh, usually means a map is on it's way to getting better.

getting no pp until ranked is still useless for me though because i think players play qualified maps so they get an advantage for pp and qualified maps without the pp/scoreboard part for me doesn't differentiate it from pending that much.

I do not know what kind of "advantage" that might be. It is not like you gain more pp the quicker you are. You gain the exact same amount of pp, regardless of when you make the play. The pp is only dependant on how good you play on the present map, not when you did it and who else played the map. These are variables not even influencing the pp gain a single bit.

I'm still not seeing how not rewarding pp helps, people will still lose their scores, still be mad and people will be confused about not gaining pp.

IMO it's black or white, keep the ranking charts or remove them. I am far more inclined to shout out and mod a map after qualification because I may possibly play it to set a competitive score. The best way to spot issues with a map is to attempt in numerous times, I will not try to set scores on a map without a scoreboard.

So from my perspective: Remove scoreboards - fine but qualified becomes disassociated with players, don't expect to see their views of a map unless their an active modder.

Keep scoreboards, remove pp until rank: Expect just as much bitching about DQ' and more confusion about pp.

Keep scoreboards: We're where we are today. This is my preference.