MAIN TOPIC

This post will be posted in ranking criteria with later on forwarded to feature request.

Currently, storyboarding, hitsounding or creating a skin for a map does not provide the people who spent time and effort contributing to the set in that way an easy way to display all of their contributions due to them not appearing in Guest Participation Beatmaps section.

REASON
All of these can take a lot of effort and I believe they should equally be counted as participating in beatmaps and not counting them in guest participations feels a bit like it's undermining their contributions to mapsets.

Hitsounds being very important for player's experience throughout any difficulty and Storyboards being a visual aspect that enhances experience with much effort needed to create it.
Creating a custom skin for a beatmap is also much effort.

PRESENTED SOLUTIONS
Ideally a special field for displaying these contributors being added would be nice, below Guest Difficulty Participation but above Pending Maps. It would also be good to have an icon that displays their contribution (Storyboard, Hitsounds, Skin...) along with text.

So, I propose the following:

Add a new part to the metadata ranking criteria that would state:

I think it shouldn't be in the same field rather somewhere like below the nominators and above tags or something like that but I also just don't know if that'd make it even more cluttered than it already is

App wrote: 6es13

I think it shouldn't be in the same field rather somewhere like below the nominators and above tags or something like that but I also just don't know if that'd make it even more cluttered than it already is

Ideally adding a new field for that would be great yeah. I agree.
Perhaps somewhere here on the red lines:



But between Nominators and Genre I think could work well,
I don't think 2 extra rows of this sized text would be too cluttered.

This feels like having a global Contributors field for each Beatmapset would somewhat solve the problem. Leaving the per-difficulty assignment to the mappers, and a Contributors section where miscellaneous contributors such as with SB, HS, GFX, SV, and anybody else deemed necessary could be assigned to and credited both in the Beatmap and their profiles respectively.

Mixing SB/HS/Mappers/etc... all in one though could be misleading with the way this is currently implemented IMO, and I would probably gear the discussion towards a Feature Request, rather than a "hack" in the RC.

That said, I agree with the spirit of the proposal. Other contributors to the set deserve more recognition than just another tag in the Metadata Sea.

Edit: Saw above, previous replies seem to echo this. Forum just didn't update in time.

RandomeLoL wrote: 2p466u

This feels like having a global Contributors field for each Beatmapset would somewhat solve the problem. Leaving the per-difficulty assignment to the mappers, and a Contributors section where miscellaneous contributors such as with SB, HS, GFX, SV, and anybody else deemed necessary could be assigned to and credited both in the Beatmap and their profiles respectively.

Mixing SB/HS/Mappers/etc... all in one though could be misleading with the way this is currently implemented IMO, and I would probably gear the discussion towards a Feature Request, rather than a "hack" in the RC.

That said, I agree with the spirit of the proposal. Other contributors to the set deserve more recognition than just another tag in the Metadata Sea.

Edit: Saw above, previous replies seem to echo this. Forum just didn't update in time.

Yeah, I agree that adding global Contributors would be nice. Definitely.
If this post does get much positive reception I would want to take it up to github or wherever I have to in order for people responsible for the website to see and for peppy to approve if possible.

I figured we should get this discussion started and get it set in motion for something to start happening in regards to contributions by SB and HS.

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Without tooting my horn - I would very much appreciate that. Honestly I'm more proud of the HS I did for someone, rathe than a GD.
Plus it's some nice exposure.

Aside from that SB (especially the well done ones) are a lot of effort in of contributing. That marker should have been added ages ago.

+1 for skin creator as well

credits for map skinners would be nice too

Bloxi wrote: 1o1v25

credits for map skinners would be nice too

Very true actually, let me adjust my post and title to reflect that as well.

As a storyboarder myself, I can only enjoy seeing such a proposal. Right now, we're pretty much forced to put all our storyboards in the me! section even if the sets get ranked (which is more often than not with SB). And even if it's culturally accepted to put contributors into the map's description, it is not a must and doesn't give much tracability when you're on a 's page.

I think both propositions of either a Contributors field or SB, HS, GFX separated fields are interesting. The first one being a bit too broad if you can't put in any way what type of contribution it was imo. The second one being probably too many information but at least saying who did what. Also, I wonder if it would be per difficulty because sometimes HS or SB (even GFX) are different per GD but other times it's just one person for the whole map making a lot of repetitions then.

I think having a field where it says contributors and that it would explicitly say in which way they contributed (either written next to the name or hovering) would feel like a good inbetween.

Props to opening this discussion. +1

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I feel like we could add more to the contributor field if we're going that route. For example, back when omdb existed (RIP), we had sections for Background Artist, Composer, Timings, minor contributions as well. As for where should contibutors should go, I was thinking of adding it near the description box (my original thought was to have it completely replace the success rate and point of failure graph cuz IMO not a lot of people actually look at those but I could be wrong)

For example (ignore the crappy inspect element edit)


I would probably propose the RC to be something like this instead

+1
hitsounds are already required to rank a map, plus storyboards and skins can carry mapsets by themselves, so displaying them clearly would be nice. timing is even more important and can also take a lot of effort and time to get right.

Mahiru Shiina wrote: 5pw26

For example, back when omdb existed (RIP), we had sections for Background Artist, Composer, Timings, minor contributions as well.

in my opinion, bg source could be a bit much due to sets with many different bgs. storyboards and skins also tend to use mana different artworks which can easily lead to a bloated bg-source/other section, and not including those wouldn't make much sense.

Oh what I had in mind was if the BG or any other contributions was specifically made by people who have an osu . It would be way more of a hassle to include outside links than profiles.

It's a bit of a weird slope where peppy in fact doesn't really want to fill up the web page / song selection with credits like those. (Noffy previously suggested something like this but was quickly shut down). It would be a cool addition, but there are also times where storyboarders or hitsounders or skin creators don't want their name associated with said storyboard. So I'm honestly a bit mixed on this.

We can make it optional for such cases, however a majority does want to be so I think adding it is good.

Again, if peppy doesn't want to fill the screen we can do by my original suggestion of adding them to 1 difficulty in the set.

Coppertine wrote: 1b404k

It's a bit of a weird slope where peppy in fact doesn't really want to fill up the web page / song selection with credits like those. (Noffy previously suggested something like this but was quickly shut down). It would be a cool addition, but there are also times where storyboarders or hitsounders or skin creators don't want their name associated with said storyboard. So I'm honestly a bit mixed on this.

ngl those that don't want to be associated with a map feels like an edge case rather than the norm but I have no proof other than I think it's that way.

hitsounder credit is definitely required to be added as hitsounds are mandatory for ranked, don't see why you shouldn't do that otherwise. similar logic applies to gds and nominators as a map needs them to be ranked.

as for the placement, I believe a separate part of the map (preferably in the genre/language/beatmap tag area) would work for placing the new contributor tag.

since peppy explicitly mentioned he doesn't want bloating, I believe a compromise for storyboard and skin creators shouldn't really need to be added, as they are inherently optional and not needed for ranking. I would encourage crediting them in description regardless.

SupaV wrote: 2c4jz

hitsounder credit is definitely required to be added as hitsounds are mandatory for ranked, don't see why you shouldn't do that otherwise. similar logic applies to gds and nominators as a map needs them to be ranked.

as for the placement, I believe a separate part of the map (preferably in the genre/language/beatmap tag area) would work for placing the new contributor tag.

since peppy explicitly mentioned he doesn't want bloating, I believe a compromise for storyboard and skin creators shouldn't really need to be added, as they are inherently optional and not needed for ranking. I would encourage crediting them in description regardless.

The proposal isn't meant to add only contributions that are required by ranking criteria but the proposal is to make heavy contributions when they are present displayed on profiles of those people are Guest Contributions and more visible areas in the map's page so that they can have more visibility and not undermine their work.

And let's be honest, making an Easy difficulty is rewarded while making a storyboard, hitsounds for the entire set or a custom skin isn't.
Even the bare minimum of storyboards, hitsounds or skins equals or is more heavy of a contribution than making an Easy difficulty.

Storyboarding, while not required is a heavy contribution that quite frankly doesn't get any kind of deserved recognition besides the person being in tags among so many others... and that's the only way to find them.

Not to mention that like stated above, storyboarders, hitsounders and skinners have to put their previous works on their !me page which is a hassle and frankly inefficient, my ultimate goal with this is to have these contributors get a profile section or to be included with Guest Pariticipation Beatmaps section so that they can more easily display the stuff they worked on and get recognition for their works, currently they barely get anything.

+1

I have 10+ hitsounds ranked on other's maps and I wish other people viewing my profile could see them. The "me!" part of my profile I would rather dedicate to unranked contributions

Same for timing, it can get really complex and take a lot more time than mapping even at times

+1
at least for storyboards because in their case they often always spend as much time and effort as it takes to create a map. On the other hand some kinds of keysounds, for example such as makes “foss” deserve a lot of attention.

The other things are important too, but to not indicate making such a large contribution in the current state seems not really good.

As for storyboarding, it would be great to consider that many maps don't have a storyboard icon, and its presence could somehow be added manually.

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We can add something undernearth the Difficulties Owners popup

Since a beatmap always have hitsound, we can leave it as the host by default (similar to asg diffs)

And the system's already got a way to tell if a set had a storyboard or nah

Would be a nice addition ngl, since storyboarding and hitsounding are time-consuming

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+1 I think global contribution mentioned by randomelol would be a cool thing

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as a hitsouder, i this. thanks for raising this topic!

i did over 90 custom hitsoundings for other people and none of them are credited on my profile. not going to tell how many hitsoundings midorijeon and leomine made, there are literally hundreds of them and i believe they also deserve to have their effort mentioned on their profiles

+1

if this gets implemented though i dont think that current “ranked guest difficulties” section is the place it should be on profile, but rather a separate section though i see how this may add unnecessary clutter

+1 for idea
but disagree on implementation, this need dev work

allow mapper to add contributor with category. so a HSer profile looks diff from a SBer profile.

if u are very talented person who can do many of these, u would like to see those maps being shown in diff category, if someone is looking at ur profile to find examples of your past work to see if they should request your expertise in certain area, it wont make sense to see them all grouped together.

ask for the best, let devs figure out the simple solution if they are lazy

Agree with the proposal yeah, And also agree that there should be different section for other type of contribution while leaving current "Guest participating beatmaps" for pure mapper GD/collab.

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yeah storyboarders are getting robbed rn

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I agree

I believe this should be a feature request and not RC proposal. But sure, agree.

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In general, I think it's a cool idea to be able to list up ranked works that are things outside of mapping, makes it easier for listing up a 's past works that are of storyboards, hitsounds, etc. So I personally would love to see this implemented.

Though just as a point of caution, here are some points that came to mind that might be an issue trying to implement this issue, whether big or small:
- Extra clutter on the 's page. Unlike "Ranked Beatmaps", and "Guest Difficulty Beatmaps" section, things like "Custom Skin", "Storyboard", "Hitsounds" feel more like an auxiliary category (Tho one can argue hitsound is more essential, since its part of RC), which results in many profiles with these empty categories, taking space. Who knows how many categories we might need to add in the future (custom art bgs, music, etc...)? But since this is just a graphical concern, it could be hidden for those without any ranked storyboards/hitsounds/custom skins/etc.

- Possible abuse on "farming" it. There could be mappers that attempt to put a single sprite, and move it around with just a single action, and call it a "Storyboard", or something similar on other categories. Would that imply we need to apply further systems and moderation that decides what constitutes as a "Ranked" Storyboard/Hitsound/Custom Skin, by seeing how much effort was put into it? Or do we call anything with a single element qualify as "Ranked"?
Tldr: Would "Regular Storyboard on a ranked map" and "Ranked Storyboard on a ranked map" be two seperate things?

I'd say that there needs to be some clear specification to be listed before attempting to implement this, since it's not exactly identical as the Mapping category in its ecosystem.

I might have some other issues on mind, but it's not fully articulated enough for me to write it down. Hope it wasn't too much of a yap 😅.

+1, great suggestion.

wonder if it can be extended to people who make art for bgs as well.
Been seeing a lot more maps with community-member drawn backgrounds, would be cool to see those people recognized and even encourage/inspire people to engage in the craft of making bgs for their mapsets/draw for osu maps.

bump

+1

big agree, surprised its not a thing already considering how nice it is to be able to properly credit gd owners.

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